Emerging Fantasy Forum Chapter 1 of my WIP

AlanThomas	Re: Chapter 1 of my WIP 9 Years Ago If I want to post a link here from somewhere else on WritersCafe, how would I go about doing it? I have a few questions I want to ask about it.
Tristyn	Re: Chapter 1 of my WIP 9 Years Ago Um... Good question. I'm assuming that you could just copy and paste the link.... Testing it now -
AlanThomas	Re: Chapter 1 of my WIP 9 Years Ago Well, that didn't work. Hmmm. I suppose I could just copy and paste it here - or portions of it, if each chapter is too long. Chapter 1 is 1300 words long as is, and it's one of my shorter chapters. But that's up to you, Tristyn since you formed this group. The thing is, I've posted two chapters in my writing section so far and while they've received a lot of views, I've only got one review on Chapter 1 so far. I was hoping to get a more direct response if I showed it directly to the members of this group. -Alan.
Tristyn	Re: Chapter 1 of my WIP 9 Years Ago Ok, Plan B. How about you give us the name of your story so we can look it up through your profile, or send us Read Requests, and we'll have a look and get back to you. It might take me a little while to get back to you because I'm pretty busy at the moment, but I promise I will get back to you as soon as I can.
AlanThomas	Re: Chapter 1 of my WIP 9 Years Ago OK, I added it to the writing list for this group. Sorry, I'm new here and I don't know how everything works yet. Thanks -Alan
Tristyn	Re: Chapter 1 of my WIP 9 Years Ago That's ok - me too. :P Glad you figured it out. Well... First thing's first... That was awesome! I'm interested already and that's only the first two chapters. Great work. Good clear story and characterisation. And I like the premise of the story. In the interests of helping to polish the story, my constructive feedback is as follows: * No errors or grammar issues. This is a fantastic start. :P * Some of the wording could be improved on - it's pretty good already, but a few nudges here and there can take it to the next level. Try reading it aloud to yourself to check the flow. It's tiny things like... "Vaclyner felt like he was being looked at through one of Demitrus' magnifying glasses." You give context later as to who he is to the town. Feed your reader the detail in small chunks and let them pretty much figure it out for themselves. Or maybe just reword it... "Vaclyner felt like some kind of captured beetle under a magnifying glass. He'd seen Demitrus using it to study them, and wondered what use the town's magic user had for studying dead beetles." Bearing in mind that obviously you'll use different words and expressions than I do, but hopefully that made some kind of sense. The best thing I can say is try and find published books that have a similar voice and study how they use the flow and wording to create the tone. *Note: when copying and pasting, sometimes hyphens come through as quotation marks, ie. " instead of -. Not an issue, just something that might be helpful to remember. There's actually not much more I can say except re-write it again and again. And when you finally think you're done, re-read it again and see if there's anything else you can fix. What I've read and been told is that all writers have terrible first drafts. It's an inevitable part of writing. But the story takes form as you re-read and re-write. You have a very very good start here, and it shouldn't take much to get it submission-ready.
AlanThomas	Re: Chapter 1 of my WIP 9 Years Ago Thanks, Tristyn! I have the first chapter posted on another writer's site and there are several people there who seem to really weigh heavy on being economical with words. I see the value in that, but I don't think I have the skills for that yet. For instance, with the bit about the magnifying glass, someone suggested I simply write "Vaclyner felt like he was being looked at though a magnifying glass..." and mention Demitrius later when he's talking to Fragiir. This makes sense to me because Demitrius isn't really a character in the story, rather just someone Vac uses as a defense against Fragiir's line of reasoning. That argument Fragiir gives is full of foreshadowing, by the way. The book's final battle will take place in Boschvilla (That's all I'm saying. Don't want to give the whole thing away just yet!) Vac's father and the rings is part of a lager plot point, but this isn't LOTR and the rings aren't magical. As I say, the real plot can be gleaned from Fragiir's warning about what's out in there in the world. But, as far as his missing father goes, I'm thinking I should add something more about that because it is a sub plot and the issue gets resolved. I'm not sure if there is enough emotional investment in that situation for Vaclyner or the reader. What do you think, Tristyn? There are a few other points they have made at the other site and I really wanted to join two sites for a balance of critiques. I think the other site was created by someone in the UK and they may have a different writing sensibility than Americans. We like it when there's a lot of information. Well, I do anyway. Thanks for your help and I"ll be sure to post more of the story later. -Alan
Tristyn	Re: Chapter 1 of my WIP 9 Years Ago Sorry it's been a while. Life waits for no fun. :( On being economical - There is a certain value in that, but my personal opinion is that you can't start writing like that. Get everything you can think of down first, and once it's all out, then you can start worrying about critique and polish. That's why I won't ask for feedback on my story yet, because I feel that I need to get everything out and then start playing with it. Otherwise I'll never get there. But then again, when I edit, I tend to add to the overall length, so maybe that's not a good example. Everyone writes differently - my advice is to trust yourself completely while you are writing and creating. And then from there, you can start seeking critique to help you finish it. Be careful of the trap of showing it to someone else too early. I've seen people show their work to someone before it was done and then when the feedback was bad, they got disheartened and stopped writing. (I've even done that to someone. :( Back when I thought that when someone asks you to edit their work, they actually want you to help them make it better, rather than just telling them it's perfect as it is.) I've also gone the other way - I showed my work to friends and family, thinking they would give me feedback on it, and they all really liked it, but then I got complacent and stopped writing. Granted, your experience could be completely different, and it's a good idea to catch these things early. Just giving you my advice, to take with a grain of salt or to ignore completely. You've made good points, and you obviously know what's going on in your story. On Vac's father - I would re-word the little section where he first gets mentioned - Vac's response. Maybe try to give it a little more impact - something like: "It was a lot to take in and Vaclyner was momentarily stunned by the mention of his father. He was just three years old when his father went hunting in the forest and never came back. All he could remember about his father was the feel of his red shirts under his little baby fists and the ring that was his last link to his father. It was too small for him now, and he wore it on a chain around his neck. His mother had told him that they were a matched set, one for each of them. She had been buried with hers when he was ten. Fragiir had been all the parent he had since then." That should be enough to show that there is a strong emotional connection there without delving too much into detail. By the time you get to the resolution, there should be enough of a connection between the reader and the main character that the reader will remember that and experience it with him. Just be careful putting too much emphasis on any one thing, unless it's supposed to be massive. The reader will pick up on subtle clues and feel like they're unraveling a mystery, but if something is obvious, it either breaks the flow and takes them out of the story, or it sets them up to expect more out of it. So make the mention of his father and the rings a part of his characterisation, and they won't be expecting something to come up. Unless they get little clues along the way. As with anything that I'm trying to foreshadow, I try to put in tiny clues - a word or a phrase here, a sentence there that the reader will only pick up on when he gets to the big reveal and finally goes 'Oh, so that's what that meant...' This is only my opinion from my personal experience - you will write differently, so trust yourself first. My job is to make you think and help you figure out your own way around your issues. Which is why it's fabulous that you're getting advice from multiple places. The more varied the input you get, the better - different angles, approaches and focuses are always going to give you a more in depth analysis.
AlanThomas	Re: Chapter 1 of my WIP 9 Years Ago Thanks Tristyn. I've been busy too. Hard to balance day job/writing/networking/relaxing, etc. The thing about the rings and Vac's father is, the mystery is solved very early, at the end of chapter 3 and what I'm trying to avoid is the reader going "Oh, is that all? Whatever." and losing interest. Vaclyner retrieves his father's ring and wears it as a keepsake and it really isn't mentioned again until much later when he runs into a foe who values jewelry of any kind most highly. The foe takes the ring as insurance that Vac will perform a certain deed, which he doesn't quite do in the end, kills the foe and takes the ring back. And that's about it. The ring and his father isn't really what the book is about, just an (hopefully) interesting device to allow the little bit of intrigue to happen much later. But I think that what you suggested is probably very close to what I'll do. I do plan on having the book professionally edited before trying to do anything with it and of course, I don't want to give any prospective editor a complete load of crap. That's what getting critiques is for. Conversely, I believe a work can be critiqued and edited to death so that it's never called "done". I'm pretty sure I'll leave the final word up to the professional and follow that advice, when the time comes. I'm assuming that when it gets the final edit, it will be shorter rather than longer, but I do agree about getting it all down at first. The process of getting first books together is probably chaotic in that way. One doesn't know what works best, so you just hold your breath and try everything that comes to mind, hoping for the best. That's how I'm doing it anyway. I'll be posting my Chapter 3 any day now and feedback would be appreciated. Thanks again -Alan