The Wood Beyond The World Forum How will the Wood grow?

I'm bumping this thread from the old days of the group, for new members to get an idea of how we're organized. The main point is to give everyone equal exposure (if they want it) so that when you have something posted to the group it'll actually appear on the home page, without the necessity of clicking on the "more" button. I plan to continue the practice of featuring the newest work for awhile, then moving the writer of that piece to the "featured writer" slot when someone else posts something new. Please add to the thread with any questions.



Now, here's the original post:



This is a great group so far -- I see some really good things happening here already, and I can't tell you all how happy that makes me. Really open exchange of ideas. Good fellowship. Good writing. Interesting stories with lots of variety.





Variety is a big concern for me, at least. I want to see all our members featured on our home page, with a certain amount of balance. We have 8 members right now, and I've set the number of new items at 15 -- I really don't want to go any higher than that, for aesthetic reasons, partly. I have a lot of stuff I want member input on -- dozens of chapters of three different books -- but I don't want to clutter up the "new writing" list. So I sent you all a message about those pieces, and set up threads for them. I'd like to ask other members to do similar; if you have a couple of things featured but want input on something else, send us all a message about it and set up a thread. If you want it on the home page, take another item of yours down -- I don't know if you can do that -- I can, as moderator -- if you can't, just message me on what you want removed, and I'll do it.





Does that sound fair to everyone? Do you see my reasoning?





I could set this up so that I'd have to approve every posting to the group, but I don't want to be in that decision-making position. I'd rather have you all make your own choices -- but I would like to keep the "new writing" list under a bit of control -- as a mutual sort of thing, though. Two posts each max, in "new writing", and messages and threads to direct members to the rest.





Let me know what you think.

Leah,

This makes perfect good sense. If I have two slots on features list, they would consist of the Scene most people are now reading, and the next Scene they will read. Nothing but my novel should be featured.

I could do with one slot, as well.

I hereby and with confidence approve any manipulation of the features list Leah thinks appropriate. Leah, you needn't ever think I'll mind what you do. Your time is best used reading and writing, not notifying us or asking our permission for needed regulation of material on the screen.

bill

I just wanted to establish a procedure early on that would be agreeable to everyone. I've never been a moderator before, though my husband made me co-moderator of our Catholic yahoogroup -- that's just a formality.

Apparently the moderator is the only member who can remove items, so whenever anyone wants to do a switch up, just message me. Like, when we've all discussed an item to death, or you want to revise something.

Agreed ::biggrin::

Leah, are we still adhering to the two stories per writer agreement, or has this expanded? i thought two per writer would help focus the group into examining particular works instead of members getting overwhelmed with the visual list of story upon story.

granted we each have our own initiative to visit each other's profiles of work, but i also know it might be irksome for you to have to accept and delete work as group moderator. Soooo, i just wanted to double check on how you were feeling about posting additional work to the group.

I see no problems with a controlled flow of featured stories. As Adam pointed out, as I am doing, I can check out all of Nick's stuff without all of his chapters being featured.

In some ways, it makes sense. Once a month, you get from everyone what they would like to highlight in their repertoire, something they want us to focus on. And having a specific list would let us know the author would like us to really, really, check it out. Sort of a nag, without a nag, right my dear? ::suprised:: And if for that month, someone doesn't have anything, fine. When they are ready, they can submit something the next month.

I haven't had much time to attend to it lately, but I would like the 2 works per member thing best. That way we have a nice round number of stories. You need to contact me to tell me what to remove if you have more than two things up here -- best to do it when you add something, I think.

Anyhow, message me about what to remove, if you need to remove something, and I'll do it.

Quote:


I don't have to accept things -- just post to the group whatever you like, whenever you like -- but if you already have two things posted, you have to let me know what to remove, 'coz only I have the power (moohahaha ::drool:: )

Ok, as a neglected group ... sorry folks ... I will be doing drive by reviews through here one chapter/posting per week starting this week. Rob

Quote:


Rob, you're only a member of a score or so -- how could you neglect us? ::cool::

I'm looking forward to your participation, in whatever form and quantity.

See ya soon.

Hello fellow Wooders,

Since Leah has asked how the Wood would grow, I would like to share a little thought with the group about reviewing and its importance.

Leah and I met on Urbis, as I did with many here...Including Rod who is also a member of other groups I belong to. Rob and I know and understand each other...I think. lol.

Now at first, Leah and I both reviewed in hit and miss fashion, a chapter here, a chapter there. I am still not sure what she saw in mine, but in her work, I saw something more complex and different from the standard fare of fantasy fiction I enjoyed at one time. Her style was very well crafted though she was a bit long winded back then and her pacing could almost come to a stop.

By the end of the summer we both were working on rewrites and started reviewing each other in order, chapter by chapter and pointing out what was and was not working. Scribbles also joined in at this time, though like all of us, her time was limited. Still, she added another element for both of us. We had each other to kick around idea's with, based on what we knew of each others storys. The back and forth went on and on into the fall and through the winter.

Now, I found that Leah and Scribble's were very dedicated to helping me, as I was in offering my limited opinions. By the end of my first book, both Leah and Scribble's offfered up a very comprehensive review of the entire thing, each pointing out or agreeing in area's where they felt the story needed work still. For this...I thanked both over and over, it was a very invaluable lesson compared to all the books I have read or classes taken.

What I would like to point out, is that reviewing a chapter here and there is great for helping a writer with a particular issue...such as passive voice, punctuation, etc. But is a single chapter indictive of the overall style. And what works in one chapter, or one piece, may not work in all. Only by having dedicated readers will the writer learn if the overall work is goint to be a hit or miss, with any audience, no matter who that targetted audience is.

Trust me...Its been like pulling teeth for Leah to get me to change up some of my preferences in grammar and such, descriptions which I fell in love with, but they were not working.

As reviewers, we read with a much more critical eye than the average reader will; picking up little bits of this and that the average reader will gloss over or not even think about. But...we are reviewing with the aspect that we all want to see our work published someday. So in essence, we are reviewing as potential agents or publishers would in reading something for the first time.

In other groups, alot has been said about if the agent does not get pass the first line, first paragraph, its over. Yes and no. I can tell you from experience, that the agent will and does read on, skimming not just the first page or chapter, but throughout the entire submission. Your opening may be the best since Tolstoy...but can the writer carry the style throughout the entire length of the book? Does the writer fall, or improve even, or with a little guidenance...become a best seller?

Ok windbag...whats the point.

I think that with continued reviews between writers that we learn and grow in our own work. Stick with someone, pick someone to work together with, reviewing each others work. Be it in this group or elsewhere. Sometimes its hard with our mundane lifes. Some of us have families who come first, and job or jobs that zap the energy from us, or schooling that demands everybit of concentration on the subjects at hand. Still, like everything else in life, if you set the time aside, just like we do for our writing, we can not but help to improve as a writer, or as a group.

Just a thought I wanted to share on a way the Wood can grow.
Nick.

I agree 100%, Nick. Yes, I know, I'm a little behind on my reviews but I had a week of nights plus insomnia, so I'll be back to reviewing your stuff in a little bit.

As I told Leah, I am focusing on your stuff from start to end, allowing me to see how things evolve. I am now into Chapter 8, heading into 9. Once I'm done, I'll focus on Leah. Then I'll find my next victim. ::biggrin::

But some of us are still working piecemeal on our series, or have just short stories for people to review. What would be nice is to have categories for us to see, allowing us to know what the author wants from this group. But I can't see how to do "sub" categories on this site.

This goes back to a point I made earlier. Instead of us putting tons of stuff here, I suggest each one of us, if we have something, put a piece on once a month as a featured story from the author. This would allow us, for those that want to, to focus specifically on one piece. And we still have access to all the other stuff for extra reading and reviewing. Just an idea.

Loekie,

My comments were not directed at anyone in particular. I know that many here will get to me when time permits, and to tell the truth, I can wait. My goal right now is not only to improve my work, but to offer my limited help or advice to others...another critical eye so to speak.

Just wanted to chime in on the benefits of not only getting reviewed, but in finding a partner to work with. One that will stick with a story more than a chapter or two or three. A writer can start out weak and improve as the story goes along, but if all the reviews they get are only of the opening chapters, then the writer may feel the entire piece suffers the same quality.

Again, just to clarify
Nick

Yes, Nick, a novelist's middle and end can be lonely territory without a partner (and I might not have uttered such words as these since I proposed to my wife!).

If you continue as you have, you will soon read further into my book than all but a few (including my wife).

I can hardly wait to see what you and Leah think of the middle, and I can hardly imagine how happy I'lll be if you two actually reach the end (I myself will get there well before the summer is out).

A novelist, more than anything but perseverance, needs a few good partners to read with. Thank you.

Quote:


I know it was. ::biggrin:: But like I said, I am now on chapter 9. Save a book on pagan religions of Britain, your stuff is my transit read.

I am glad a few people are here with more than a couple of chapters, so I can sink my teeth into something more complete. If I wanted to, I could put the complete first drafts of volume 1 and 2 of Tangled Threads for people to read. Yet with the current revisions, I don't know if it is worth the effort. Unless you guys want to see the old stuff then compare it with the new stuff coming down the pike over the next few months.

you all work quicker than i do. I read slowly and deliberately, often going back for a few more reads and often think about things before i respond. I even look at the review writing process as an important writing exercise in itself (as i've argued on the cafe forum several times when i petitioned there be a featured reviewer section, which they made to same pale degree -- to my complete disappointment).

I also do the same when writing. the conception of the things i write often takes a lot of time, i plan things, try things on for size, window shop, etc. And then i go back and it's like looking at old hair cuts i used to sport: what was i thinking, i think.

So, as sparse as my participation may be, i hope that when i do make some publicized efforts that it is not overlooked as a convenience. I have a feeling many of you feel the same about the efforts you put into the reading and writing and conception of things.

Adam, each one of us is different. I have always been one to dive in and state my opinions. And then there are people like you who think first before responding. That is what makes this group interesting.

And you have been making a great contribution to the group. Some of us may have verbal diarrhoea while you get straight to the point with lucid comments. And right now I am even worse because I just finished a long shift and my brain is in overdrive. And listening to Bob Seger and I have my beer beside me. Be afraid, very very afraid. ::suprised::

Loekie,

Back on urbis, when I was reviewing Leah chapter by chapter, and revision by revision, I found it helpful to refresh myself with a previous version before commenting on a revision. Sometimes I liked what she cut out and would explain why. Other times the revisions were so minor I would have missed them. Also, when your only reviewing someones work with long stretches inbetween, you may have forgotten what you reviewed, what you commented on, etc.

Now with me, once I have gotten my reviews and acted on them, I pull the chapters down, just to unclutter the profile page and listings.

Nick.

So are you stepping up to the plate and willing to check out the cranky draft 1 of my stuff? ::confused::

Nick,

I keep all my reviews for novelists pasted into Word files, so that I can look back at them any time I please. Makes it easier to keep track of lots of characters, especially those that make spot appearnances. I want the quality of my reviews from later chapters not to suffer because I might have forgotten a character or important turn of events, and so guard against making such mistakes.

billw