The Review Club Forum Discussion of Loekie's Birthda..

Leah, you are preaching to the choir here. Unlike contemporary fiction, be it fantasy or sci-fi, we have to hit the ground running and grab the reader. And we don't want to overload the reader with too much information, dragging the narrative.

That is the major problem I have with Tangled Threads. The later stuff is fine, it is just getting the reader involved from the onset. And without constantly reminding the reader there are appendices to fill in the gaps.

That is why I am hard on first chapters. And I want the same thing for my first chapters. I am a major fan of Tolkien. I have all the books his son, Christopher published showing the evolution of his writing. And it gives me hope because his first few chapters were horrible. But over time, the ideas evolved to become the gem that it is.

Things like Strider was originally a hobbit named Trotter who wore wooden shoes and didn't work. And he knew it. I am still struggling with some characters. All too often I forget, I'm not in charge here, they are. Let them speak. Let them act.

In the end, what is important to me is to hear what people think of the piece. It is like Tolkien with the Inklings. He had his vision, he had an idea what he wanted to say. He never strayed from that. But the feedback he received allowed him to hone what he wanted to say.

That is why I take reviewing seriously. I am not expecting anyone to change what they are writing to fit my personal interests. But if I bring something that makes you go "hum", I've done my job.

We are too close to our pieces. We know what we want to say. But sometimes it comes out a little skewed and needs a slight adjustment. If it weren't for people like C.S Lewis, Lord of the Rings would not be what it is today.

Loekie,

Perfect. Absolutely perfect. I have no other words. You've explained it perfectly.

-cc

Purr, purr, I love my ego being stroked.

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Creepy. ::biggrin::

Did C.S. Lewis really help Tolkien with L.O.T.R? Very cool.

Indeed... Treebeard is actually based on C.S. Lewis... ok now I'm letting my geek show. :)

For the non-geeks out there, the Inklings were a group who would meet and each would read chapters of their books. C.S. Lewis loved LOTR but Tolkien had issues with some of Lewis's stuff. Here is a quote he wrote about Lewis to Stanley Unwin:
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So I raise Cameron's geek with my uber-geek.
And for Julie, be afraid, be very afraid ::suprised::

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Here I thought no one could out geek Cam...

And Loekie, I am terrified. Terrified geekiness is contagious. ::tongue::

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Join the collective. Resistance is futile.

Cameron, for some of us, it is a part of the game plan. I just got Book 12, The Peoples of Middle-Earth by Christopher Tolkien and am eager to curl up and read it.

But at the same time, our geekness has a purpose. When I first started Tangled Threads, I grew frustrated when things weren't working out. Up to that point, I had written short stories and never tackled a novel, let alone a series.

Getting to know the evolution of LOTR should give any writer hope. When I read the first drafts of Fellowship, I was stunned. There were glimmers of what was to come but yech! It wasn't dark. Strider was a hobbit with wooden shoes. The hint of history wasn't there. It was just another hobbit adventure with no depth.

When I read that stuff and sensed his struggling, I saw myself in his shoes. I saw his struggle to find the right voice, the right characters. And then my frustration sluiced away. If someone I greatly admire had problems, well I am in the same boat.

And in the end, with all the struggles I've been through, if I can come up with something even 1/4 of scope and impact that LOTR has been, I will die a happy man.

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Ok so I'm going to commit the cardinal sin of fantasy fans, and say reading Fellowship of the Ring should give you hope. The book is dreadfully slow, boring and completely overwritten. In fact if I ever reread the series I'm going skip straight to Two Towers because I know I won't finish Fellowship again. But I agree, it should give you hope.

You ain't going to get flamed by me, here. Cameron. You, like many, feel the same way. Which is fine. I'm not a zealot. Be it Tolkien, even Rowlings, they hit brick walls. People were leery at publishing their stuff. And now look at where they are now.

I know I am standing at a precipice but I adore J.K Rowlings. She hit the target with her audience and sucked in adults like myself. Partly because I read her stuff as a former kid. I am shy of 50 but still remember what it is to be young.

At the same time, she had 19 rejections before she was picked up. And look at her now. The sad thing is that all too often this is not out there. All of us struggle with our work. We hope to get published and people grok what we are saying. But many of the big names struggled also to get the "classics" out there. We need more of that out there to remind us the journey is worth it. There is a chance, a faint sliver of hope. How many fledgling writers gave up because of the machine called the publishing industry?

Okay, now I can get off my soap box and address B.B Curtis's review. First of all, ouch! You caught things I didn't see. I didn't realize I was being so repetitive with some of the words. Time to go back and be brutal! ::biggrin::

And thanks for the little points on the POV. The original version of the book was multiple POVs. My revisions is focusing on each section gives a specific POV. And your points are dead on.

And I cannot say the thrill I got when I read: This truly gave me happy chills at the end. As you pointed out, it isn't easy to get that across without getting cliched.

As to the secondary characters like Gwenn, Medyr., etc., yes they are important pieces of the puzzle. Actually my next submission to the group will be the introductory chapter for Medyr. Gwenn, though, is not a critical character but a running thread through the first part of the novel. Sort of the Mother Earth character to echo things which become important later.

Thanks for your points. They are invaluable.